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Analog loudspeaker management devices

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Turo View Drop Down
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    Posted: 14 June 2014 at 1:28pm
Sorry for my english. I don't know if the subject is misleading.

I am asking for older, proven to be good, FOH gear they don't have to vintage. They can be even "lo-fi" but robust and reliable. Is it called FOH: eqs, x-over and time correction etc? Particulary relating to loudspeaker management and they should be analog. This is not a wanted topic. I'm asking for help from those who know about this stuff. I don't have that kind of knowledge, yet..

I have been thinking about replacing my berry dsp with an analog system. I don't know if it makes any sense. At least i would look cooler : D lots of 1U gadgets.

I've had for a while now a dream of vintage rig with all analog system.

Is BSS TCSs analog? Is there some analog time correction units? Should i make them myself, i know there's most of what i need in ESP-pages.. : ) the sound quality might not be that good hah.

Best Regards -Turo
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TONY.A.S.S. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 June 2014 at 2:22pm
You will find that most all in one units are digital, and you won't find Analogue delay units that are adjustable across the range.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote audiomik Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 June 2014 at 2:32pm
Re: "you won't find Analogue delay units that are adjustable across the range"

You can, although they are somewhat few and far between these days.

The Klark Teknic DN 34, used in delay only mode, is a good example. It has dual "Bucket brigade" delay elements in differential mode to reduce noise.

The BBD IC is the SAD1024, datasheet available here:
http://www.datasheetarchive.com/SAD1024-datasheet.html

Otherwise there are numerous Analog crossovers capable of having added EQ

Mik

Edit: add IC type and link

Edited by audiomik - 14 June 2014 at 3:06pm
Warning! May contain Nuts
plus springs, washers, screws, etc, etc.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote shagnasty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 June 2014 at 3:43am
The Berry DSP (I assume DCX) lay waste to most analogue kit the moment you need any delay, Yes a FDS-360 sounds amazing on a physically time-aligned rig, but a TCS is no use for aligning drivers, they were made to align stacks of drivers, a TCS-804/803 was great for rigging delay towers but tag stripping a couple into a fds-360 would make me buy a Soundweb/Omnidrive in seconds...
 
I have never seen an anoluge LMS, the Turbo LMS-760 was basically 2 FDS-360s and a TCS-804 in box, you could wind the subs off the Flash, but the rest was fixed...
 
A digital upgrade from a DCX is 10x the cash, a viable Analogue upgrade would be 30x the cash!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote audiomik Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 June 2014 at 11:45am
Turo
it appears that the SAD1024 IC is very difficult to find, however a replacement which is available could be the MN3007.
Some useful info here: http://music-electronics-forum.com/t23353/

Good luck with constructing something based on these delay ICs. I did some designs and built a number of delay units based on the SAD1024 back in the 1970's, so PM me if you'd like assistance although my memory of some details may be missing!

Mik
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Turo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 June 2014 at 10:55pm
Thanks for the replies! The quest for analog time correction unit seems really tuff. I have to look into this BBD IC if it's worth a shot. After reading a few posts about it it doesn't seem to have a good reputation about the sound quality. I understand the difficulties of analog time correction and using such with precision : )

Originally posted by audiomik audiomik wrote:


Otherwise there are numerous Analog crossovers capable of having added EQ
Can you name one? Here's what i was looking about: http://sound.westhost.com/project09.htm
of course it doesn't have to be a DIY.
Also analog limiters are of interest and i think this could be easily done as a DIY? 6in 6out limiter unit?

And one more thing how hard is analog phase adjustment?

I'm starting to realize how much these 1U DSPs can do! : D
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote shagnasty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 June 2014 at 11:00pm
Originally posted by Turo Turo wrote:

Thanks for the replies! The quest for analog time correction unit seems really tuff. I have to look into this BBD IC if it's worth a shot. After reading a few posts about it it doesn't seem to have a good reputation about the sound quality. I understand the difficulties of analog time correction and using such with precision : )

Originally posted by audiomik audiomik wrote:


Otherwise there are numerous Analog crossovers capable of having added EQ
Can you name one? Here's what i was looking about: http://sound.westhost.com/project09.htm
of course it doesn't have to be a DIY.
Also analog limiters are of interest and i think this could be easily done as a DIY? 6in 6out limiter unit?

And one more thing how hard is analog phase adjustment?

I'm starting to realize how much these 1U DSPs can do! : D
 
BSS FDS-360 takes EQ cards (eg CD Horn) as well as Frequency cards...
 
I stand by my comment, Analogue crossover, great, analogue LMS, gonna be a mess!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote opus jody Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 June 2014 at 11:11pm
Opus crossovers have delay card slots, & up to 4 parametric eq sections per side.
Old DDA crossovers sound really nice, imo, for very little money.
This guy can't sell it for £100, probably because of the strange crossover point - 14KHz (?!?)
but it's easy to change the components to something more sensible.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DDA-Audient-DD500-2-Way-Stereo-4-Way-Mono-Active-Electronic-Crossover-/261506745419?pt=UK_Musical_Instruments_Outboards_Effects_MJ&hash=item3ce304444b
Improvised Hardware Music http://vimeo.com/user9389813/videos
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Turo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 June 2014 at 3:22pm
Is Klark Teknik devices good quality?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote imageoven Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 June 2014 at 4:09pm
yes
Keep pushing on, things are gonna get better.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote burningbush Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 June 2014 at 4:10pm
Generally yes, bit better than most. I'm bidding on the £78 one, the two cheaper units are good aswell but Im not on those.WinkLOL
music is the message
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Turo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 June 2014 at 6:10pm
Originally posted by burningbush burningbush wrote:

Generally yes, bit better than most. I'm bidding on the £78 one, the two cheaper units are good aswell but Im not on those.WinkLOL
I'll leave that one alone then : >
Thanks
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