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tapped horn design

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james folkes View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote james folkes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 January 2007 at 11:18am
william cowan's research is very interesting, we are so very indebted to those who take their time to document this stuff for the good of fellow enthusiasts... what i don't get is why his 60 Hz horn gets worse as you move the driver up the horn? having read danley's white paper and looked at the other commercial tapped horns i thought that the driver in the mouth would not load the upper range of the horn's response, and was accordingly going to try a different position on the mkII giatt...

can anyone hint at what's going on here then? or do i need to make a series of boxes at the different "tappings" and try and measure them all?

james.
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Mircea Bartic View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mircea Bartic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 January 2007 at 12:25pm
james, it is acting just as the first version of planar horn

as you move the driver more inside the horn, the mouth becomes to small to sustain the wavelengts involved.

with the driver nearer to the horn exit it acts more as a bassreflex design lower down in frequency.

everything I said here happens besides the usual problems associated with phasing between the horn output and driver output.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote philpope Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 January 2007 at 3:27pm
yeah i don't know why cowans results were bad for the driver being away from the mouth as this is apparently what the danley dts20/pb12 model is.

none of the diy attempts at a tapped horn other than mine have moved the tap away from the horn throat which i think is very important for good results. doing so moves the driver away from a velocity minimum and means you can keep the compression ratio and cabinet volume low at the same time. it will also reduce resonant modes as is done when offsetting drivers in a transmission line.

not too sure what varying the compression ratio from 1;1 will do but i think this must be the case in something like the TH215 or the horn wouldn't fit in the cabinet volume. i worked from the assumption that 1;1 compression would give the best bass response and least stress on the cone.

will post some measurements from my cabinet as soon as i have some. got some ideas about how the TH112 and outline boxes are folded so might be able to make something along those lines. not found a very suitable 12" driver yet though.

Phil
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philpope View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote philpope Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 January 2007 at 8:21pm
there are some interesting photos at

http://srforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/m/184228/2366/#msg_184228
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote odc04r Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 February 2007 at 5:37am
I may be completely off base, but I wonder if the classic scoop dip in response at ~100Hz has anything to do with the dip that can be seen inm William Cowan's results. I was thinking about it the other day and maybe a scoop could be considered as a tapped horn with driver located right at the start of the horn and the front of the driver firing into a very large last expansion (the room.) 
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jethrocker View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jethrocker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 February 2007 at 1:05pm
odc04r, Moray James started discussion on this over in the scoop forum and we were wondering if the tap horn effect in a scoop might be enhanced by angling the baffle into horn mouth, this would also enlarge mouth area to the size of the front of the whole cab.
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote philpope Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 February 2007 at 6:53pm
I may well be wrong because I haven't done much research on scoops (because the measurements and sound of most scoops I have seen/heard has been unpromising).
 
doesn't the back chamber in most scoops act as a low pass filter precisely to minimise the frequency range where horn and DR are interfering. also a scoop doesn't tap into the horn away from the throat end.
 
Phil
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote philpope Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 February 2007 at 6:58pm
Originally posted by philpope philpope wrote:

there are some interesting photos at

http://srforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/m/184228/2366/#msg_184228
 
I'm looking at the picture of the TH215s. can see through the mouth to the back of the cabinet where there is a little wedge splitting the horn into two seperate paths, yeah? what's that white strip on the bottom speaker? is it inside? is it a driver? if so, why can't the same be seen in the top speaker?
 
Phil
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mykey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mykey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 February 2007 at 8:45am
Originally posted by jethrocker jethrocker wrote:

odc04r, Moray James started discussion on this over in the scoop forum and we were wondering if the tap horn effect in a scoop might be enhanced by angling the baffle into horn mouth, this would also enlarge mouth area to the size of the front of the whole cab.
 
 

Haha! your ketching up with me

i have been working on a sub called "DUBSUB" (scoop) with a 12.75 ft around 3.65 metre horn and is the cats wisker's and scare's the life out of me

you can dry your hair from this beast
 
single 18''
 
just tested it yesterday in a 3 badminton court sports hall, and haven't stopped smilling since, it was turning the whole room into a huge resonator.
 
i have a pic of my prototype if anyone is interested?
it's a bit rough, no sanding and finishing, it also has a piece of 2x4'' across the mouth .
 
this horn is so efficient i had to stand on the box (14 stone 89kg) to stop it from moving and it didnt stop it
then i bridged the Dynacored amp,  and had the biggest grin on my face
the closest i have heard to this bin is he big bertha, which is a huge mother
if i were to put 4 of these together it would out perform it with no barn doors (horn extension)
 
outside i had to stand it up, inside it was so much better on it's side using the floor as an extension
 
jethroker! it's been along time since i was excited about a project like this
 


Edited by mykey - 02 February 2007 at 9:27am
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COWFOOT View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote COWFOOT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 February 2007 at 8:49am
Hey Mykey: Let's have the pic.
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mykey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mykey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 February 2007 at 8:57am
ok ! but not an internal one
give me a min
 


Edited by mykey - 02 February 2007 at 9:07am
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mykey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mykey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 February 2007 at 9:09am
these with say something like an HD15 i would have a clash with anyone, c'mon stikem up!
 
i kneeled on this box for about 30 seconds and almost lost my senses
 


Edited by mykey - 02 February 2007 at 9:16am
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